Utopias in history and an environmental disaster

Rutger Bregman explores past attempts to create a better society, while Julian May explains what happened when a huge oil tanker ran aground off the British coast in 1967


Writer and thinker Rutger Bregman discusses his new book Utopia for Realists, exploring examples of how to create a better society. Meanwhile, we speak to BBC radio producer Julian May about the aftermath of the Torrey Canyon disaster, when a huge oil tanker ran aground in 1967